Feeling Sorry for Oneself
I was having lunch with a friend yesterday to talk about a book he's writing on self-compassion that he thought he might want me to do some editing work on. Hearing some of his ideas seemed to fit with some of my own thoughts lately and also were close to some helpful things other folks on JIMGP have said to me, particularly DL (great minds... 
). He was saying that one of the things the book is about is learning to sit with one's own pain rather than to act on it. It's kind of a natural survival mechanism that when we feel pain or fear we try to alleviate it--you know, better to react first and think later when the sabre-tooth tigers chasin' ya :-)
But he was saying with emotional pain it's good to try and retrain oneself to just feel the pain rather than to rush into taking some action. He was saying that it helps him to think of "feelijng sorry for yourself" in a positive way. That is feel the pain as one would a physical pain--don't beat up on yourself for having it and thus need to try to immediately stop having it.
Star Trek and other stories
Stip, you reminded me of "The Empath" episode--which was always one of my favorites, except that I would have preferred it withouth the helpless aspect of the female empath character--as "empathy" was associated with strength and heroism in the three male leads.
Another snippet of thinking about "stories" in relation to this: when we feel pain, I think something human beings do especially as problem solvers is to heal the pain by making up a story as to its cause. And yes, healing pain is not a bad thing--when we feel physical pain our body signals us to do something to care for ourselves and that's a good idea. I think more commonly with psychic pain though when we start attributing causes and start making up the story of what happened we're more likely to make judgments. I'm not sure why this is exactly but again it seems like a good reason to just experience without trying to explain.
Self Help makes you feel worse
An article on the BBC News site today talks about a study done in Canada in which people describing themselves as having low self-esteem were asked to repeat to themselves the phrase "I am a loveable person." The effect was to make the person feel worse. (Those with high self-esteem reported a minor increase in feeling good.)
"They found that, paradoxically, those with low self-esteem were in a better mood when they were allowed to have negative thoughts than when they were asked to focus exclusively on affirmative thoughts"
It also reminded me of several postings on the site--well this one obviously :-) 'cause I think that's what my friend is trying to get at in his book. Self-compassion as a way to feel sorrow/pain/fear rather than a way to falsely bolster one's self-esteem with a "feel-good" mantra.
It also reminded me of a link to something the GC posted some time ago--something that had to do with the idea that we don't have personalities? But I can't find that.
And of what DL was saying about consumerism. It's interesting that these self-help books first emerged during the period when modern consumer culture was just about to take off. (As the article notes the first book "Self Help" was written by Samuel Smiles during the Victorian Age.)
The Bright Side
Interesting interview with Barbara Ehrenreich about her new book “Bright-Sided: How the Relentless Promotion of Positive Thinking Has Undermined America.” I think the central thesis is that it has made us not take inequalities seriiously, and decreased activisim ('cause we're just going to "think" things better), as well as acting as a critique of those who are suffering (they need to correct their thinking).
And just for sillies: Always look on the bright side of life...la la ..
self help makes you feel worse
That's pretty interesting. It makes sense though. Treating a personality that has adapted to have a low self esteem by calling on a positive mantra, would feel like repeating a lie over and over again to someone with that issue.
In the case of a person with low self esteem; it would seem that to acknowledge the truth of whatever negative is going on would allow their feelings about that event to be validated. The next step in self compassion is to acknowledge the truth about the good things that may come from this perceived negative event as well. It's a subtle shift in focus... along the lines of "count your blessings" and such.
That people with high self esteem felt slightly better for a bit suggests to me that there's the possibility for an imbalance in the other direction as well. I can't help but think of the Mirandasings08 videos out there on youtube.
Selling self help books may be framed as empowering an individual to stand on their own, however the reality is that the person seeking the help is actually relying upon the advice of the author which keeps the person's sense of self worth reliant on feedback/approval from the outside. That's exactly the point of a sales pitch. It keeps the individual beholden to the fear/pain/sorrow instead of allowing the individual to get over their negative feelings and truly heal.
help, self & otherwise
That video was sad (I watched the "Dancing Queen One)...I think I'd see that person as having low self esteem, though, rather than high self esteem--unless they're meant to be parodies.
When you said "feedback/approval," did you mean feedback that is approving? Or did you mean any kind of feedback or approval? 'Cause I think that the acknowledgement of the truth of whatever negative is going on is sometimes helped from feedback from outside--constructive criticism.
Dancing Queen
Self referentially, I would guess that Miranda would believe that she has a high self esteem. She's responded to constructive criticism as people being jealous of her talent - and seems to really believe it. Unfortunately after viewing the progression of her films from beginning to end - I'd have to guess they are not parodies.
I would guess that a "high self esteem" is being measured by a level of confidence in oneself, though I'm only guessing since I don't have access to the raw data of that study. I've not seen a scientific approach to determine which self referential positive claims are "true or false". When it comes to claims like "I'm an excellent singer" - it's relative and subjective at best.
No... not feedback that is approving. I mean that a person who needs a self help book to validate their innermost thoughts and beliefs (positive or negative) is not building a self esteem, but relying on the author as a form of comfort.
I'm not trying to say that self help books are worthless or that every reader always takes them in this way. I'm saying the frame of mind when reading these books is extremely important - and a person who has a chronic problem building a solid self identity runs the risk of merely adapting the constructive criticisms unchecked, without consideration to whether these suggestions are really the best for them personally. Either that or on the other extreme. (For illustrative purposes - assuming my presumptions are on target) Someone like Miranda is going to feel they don't need a self help book at all because from her perspective her self esteem isn't a problem - or will use them to validate the position she's already taken and not see the negative things as applying to her at all.
In the cases where someone is already having a hard time seeing the truth about themselves, I'm not sure how likely it is that they're going to find the answer in a self help book. I'd suggest that the defenses have to go down and habits set aside first. I could go on and on about the format of most self help books and how they're not really conducive to that, but I won't.Assessing self esteem/confidence
You raised a very good point about how exactly that measure was made. I poked around a bit to see if I could find out generally how those things are assessed and didn't really come up with anything definitive. But did get these results which I thought were all interesting:
First I tried googling "psychological tests self-confidence" and every link I opened there took me to a site offering to boost my self confidence through some system (that I imagine would eventually require a purchase).
So changed to "google scholar" and got some abstracts that described tests in which confidence was measured by asking participants to assess how well they thought they would do on a particular test and then comparing with how well they actually did. Differences between the two seemed to measure over confidence, accurate assessment or under confidence.
Then did a similar search on scholar for self esteem. The only test I saw there was one in which a comparison was made between a subject's description of what an ideal should be and what they thought they actually were. So high self esteem there would be very close between ideal and actual. That doesn't get at how accurate the assessment is though.
There was another abstract which distinguished between stable high self esteem (which seemed to be an accurate assessment) and fragile high self esteem (which didn't seem accurate)--couldn't get an idea from the abstract though as to how those two were determined.
ETA: Ah that first interesting result of getting linked to sites trying to sell something turns out to be because my secondary computer has a virus that's taking me to those sites everytime I do a search :-(
We need our pain
Reading this reminded me of a scene from Star Trek 5 when Kirk defends his decision to NOT have his emotional pain cleansed:
"Pain & guilt can't be taken away by a magic wand. They're the things we carry with us that make us who we are. If we lose them, we lose ourselves. I don't want my pain taken away. I NEED MY PAIN!"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLzJAebfEIg
Indeed I understand that. When I lost my father 30 years ago, that loss kicked off the most gruelling stretch of years of my life. But today, BECAUSE I survived that test of will, my emotional armor is stronger to deal with tragedy, both my own and others. BECAUSE I carry around those memories, they help me to feel invincible, as if no arrow the evil in life shoots at me can destroy me. Hurt me, yes. Destroy me, no. Like a flu shot makes you immune, carrying around your pain can be a near limitless source of internal strength that power one's drive to survive, to thrive, to help others.